Speaker 1 (00:00):
ISAs, who needs them and when? How do you comp them? What if they want to become real estate agents? Can they be overseas? Scripts. How closely should your team follow them? Where are the non-negotiables and where is their room to be human? Motivations and objections. How can your team uncover them in a helpful way that meaningfully improves client experience? You're about to enjoy a fun and tactical conversation with Nikki Pice, who coaches ISAs, agents, and team leaders across North America on better conversations, effective nurturing, and more closings. Get strategies and tactics to overcome sales skepticism with Nikki Pice right now on Real Estate Team OS.

Speaker 2 (00:44):
No matter where your business is today or where you want to take it, you'll get there faster and more profitably with an operating system. Welcome to Team OS, your guide to starting, growing, and optimizing real estate team. Here's your host, Ethan Butte.

Speaker 1 (00:59):
Nikki, I feel like you're one of those people who is in her zone of genius as a conversion coach, and I'm excited to discover what you've been learning by working with ISAs and agents and sales managers and team leaders across North America every day, as well as what you learned as an EA, ISA, and director of sales yourself. Welcome to Real Estate Team OS.

Speaker 3 (01:19):
Yay. Thank you for having me, Ethan. I'm so happy to be here.

Speaker 1 (01:21):
Me too. I'm really glad that you're here. We always start with the same question, which is what is a must have characteristic of a high performing team?

Speaker 3 (01:28):
Application.

Speaker 1 (01:29):
Tell me more. Tell me more. I hear kind of execution in that too, but talk about it.

Speaker 3 (01:35):
The truth of the matter is that the teams that make a difference, it isn't as though, for example, the coaching that they've heard is any different between teams that I'm working with. The difference is whether they implement. And what I'm saying by application is that the only reason that I made it as far as I have is because when I heard something, I ran to use it. I didn't doubt that thing. I didn't try to take that thing and make it my own. When I would hear something, I would execute it that way the first 20 or 30 times precisely. And then I knew from repeated instances, whether that worked or if it needed any alteration at that time, that's what I mean by application.

Speaker 1 (02:16):
Okay. I love that for a variety of reasons. One of the things that I hear in what you shared there is this idea that we get an idea and we maybe want to make it our own before we've actually tried it. And you have to assume that when ... Let's just assume it's a trusted source, someone you value a little bit. You have to assume that you learned it from someone and they communicated it to you in a way that has been tried and tested before. And so why mess with it until you've learned for yourself versus just changing it on its face?

Speaker 3 (02:48):
And the trusted side of that, I had a conversation with my uncle who told me, Nikki, he's a teacher and he's been a teacher for 30 years. And he said, "If I hear something from a teacher that is new, I can't learn from them because I've been doing it so long." And I told him, "The thing is that even a broken clock is right twice a day. And every single time that I hear something, I'm listening for the thing that I can use and that one thing that I can use, that's going to be my takeaway." And I think that the mistake that some of us make is that we'll try something, but because it didn't have the results we expected, we say that thing doesn't work. And so we impose our own boundaries until what we're willing to do is so tiny that we reject any possibility of the new thing working when it does.

Speaker 3 (03:39):
It works for plenty of people over and over again. It's just that willingness to continue applying.

Speaker 1 (03:45):
Yeah. Okay. You just introduced another really interesting question here, which is results, right? And I know we're talking a little bit in the hypothetical, although we're also not. So I guess maybe share an example of one comes to mind. But I really reacted strongly internally to this idea of we didn't get the results that we wanted. And so we further limited it, further cut it down or discarded it prematurely or whatever. I think one of the biggest mistakes people make in this application or execution zone or trying things out that they learned from someone or from somewhere is that they don't have a realistic timeline or even a realistic picture of what results we should be getting. If that's not controlled, then we're just left to our own and we expect that we're going to make a million dollars in the next three months from this tactic or something.

Speaker 3 (04:37):
Yeah. So one of the examples that comes to mind, and it's so elelementary, but I've heard a ton of sales coaches say, "Don't ask how are you at the beginning of a conversation?" And I've seen tremendous results by asking because people don't only move for happy reasons. They move for plenty of terribly traumatic and sad reasons too. And so by starting a conversation with, "Hey, Ethan, this is Nikki out in Myrtle Beach. How are you? " I get a temperature check and you can be annoyed and I can work with that. Plenty of rude people buy homes. You can be kind and I can match that. Or you might be in a sad place, but I'm ready to acknowledge it and say, "Oh my gosh, what's going on? " That has brought more people into me, not pushed people further away. And that's one of those things that when I introduce it, that's the very beginning of a call.

Speaker 3 (05:28):
That's something that people sometimes feel hesitant or resistant to because they've heard that it must be otherwise. And I tell you from thousands and thousands of calls that it does work and you'll see the results of that after doing it, those 20 or 30 times of applying it.

Speaker 1 (05:44):
Yeah. And you'll find your own little way to do it. Okay. What a fun start. And for anyone watching and listening who's like, "Wow, that was really great. That was tactical. We've got a lot more tactical stuff coming, but where I want to go next, Nikki, is how do you wind up coaching people on conversion?" Give me a quick run, your path into real estate and how you got all of these ... I mean, I assume you've got your 10,000 hours in and 10,000 calls, et cetera. Tell us a little bit of that story.

Speaker 3 (06:12):
So I started as a broker's assistant and I was doing all things for them, transaction coordinating, social media, managing their lead generation. And I asked for a dollar raise. I think I was making like eight or $9 an hour and they said no. And I called 10 other top teams in the area and I said, "Here are my skills. Do you think anybody in your office would benefit from something like that? " And that's how I got my first ISA position. Little did I know that was a reflection of the type of ISA I would be that I'm cold calling, looking to see if there's a position like that. Totally. And so when I started the ISA, it was the most amount of money I'd ever had the opportunity to earn and I was hungry. So I would work like 60 hours a week when I was scheduled for like 40 because I knew if I could get more people, I would end up with more closings.

Speaker 3 (07:13):
And so after I did that for so long, my CEO at the time said that after enough time had passed, they would give me a 1% increase and they also said no to the 1% increase. And I had met all goals and exceeded them. Well, at that time, Travis Halvorsen, my dear and darling friend, we were in community together and he was the one who said, "You know, Nikki, with numbers like that, you could go anywhere." I had over a hundred closings in my first year and for every year after that. And so that was the jumpstart. And then Travis told me at one point, wherever I go, I will take you. Thank you, Travis. And that's how I got here.

Speaker 1 (07:53):
Awesome. Travis Halvorsen has been our guest. We talked very specifically about the ISA function. I think that was episode 15. It's just a guess. I know a lot of them kind of like right at hand. I don't know that one, but it's right in that zone. For anyone that wants to go deep in the ISA function with Travis, that was like around episode 15, 16, somewhere in that area. You're now coaching all kinds of folks, ISAs primarily, but agents of course as well. And we'll get into like who should be using who for what stages of the relationship. But what are some of the most common problems you see in here? As you're engaging with all these different real estate teams and brokerages and organizations, what are some of the most common problems you see in this zone of conversations and conversions?

Speaker 3 (08:39):
Exceptions. It's either an exception in the conversation where they think for that person I didn't have to use the objection handler. For that person I didn't have to ask the question or it's an in- house exception. That person doesn't have to make that many calls. That person doesn't have to change their script or leave it in their CRM. And that's where you see a break in structure. When your foundation is off balance, it's going to affect everything else. And so I'm a really big stickler for no exceptions, which means both agents and ISAs are doing lead generation, so they would all benefit from the training. There can be no exceptions. The best practices remain the best practices, no matter who's listening.

Speaker 1 (09:18):
The one that triggered something for me was, or there's an individual person who doesn't have to behave like the rest of the team. And so some people might look at it and say, "Oh, it's a reward." But in general, that is foundationally threatening.

Speaker 3 (09:32):
And ultimately, if you want it to be a reward, that would not make it an exception, that would make it a tier. That means that others would be able within a certain amount of accomplishments to be able to receive the exact same exception. So if you want it to be something that's now a standard, that's no longer an exception. If you want it to be something that the entire team follows, that means that you would tier that thing off and say, "At this exact point of either closed units or conversations or whatever that looks like, now the exception is, " and you name what the exception becomes. Yeah,

Speaker 1 (10:04):
Yeah. Define it. Why am I treating this person differently? What have they achieved? What was kind of like the trigger point or what was the conversation that was had? Maybe I want a 1% raise. No, I'm just kidding. Okay. Let's go specifically to coaching and training. When you think about whether it's a sales manager or it's a director of inside sales or whether it's a real estate team leader, on coaching and training, first of all, if you want to separate those words and really break them apart, I'm using them somewhat interchangeably and I know that that's not necessarily fair or accurate to do, but when you think about what ... As you're doing your own discoveries, you're getting to know a leader or a team or an organization that you're about to engage with over the next many months, what are some tips that you have for someone to think about or execute coaching or training more effectively?

Speaker 3 (10:56):
So specifically, the distinction for me is that training is the how-to. If you think of a literal coach, the coach is the person who keeps the team accountable and that doesn't change. Your training is your drills and repeating practices, but your coaching means that we're expecting a standard and we account for the standard. And so there is a difference between a trainer who tells people what to do, but there's a difference between a coach who makes sure that all of the training is implemented. If you're looking for somebody who's going to be your coach or your trainer, that person really needs to be the function that you're expecting. And when I say function, I mean if you don't have defined what the person is doing, it's not going to work. So your definition for person should mean you spend one hour in CRM training, you spend four hours in one-on-one coachings with agents, the frequency of which those coachings are going to take place.

Speaker 3 (11:49):
When they are in coachings, they should have a paper that shows this is how many messages you're allowed to have in your inbox. This is how many days are allowed to pass between communication. This is how many leads you're allowed to have in your name. That's what I mean by function. You have a specific purpose for the individual. Now they're a perfect fit. And don't get me wrong, sometimes I meet with people who say, "Well, I don't know what we need, but I know that we need it. " Okay, great. You're looking for a coach. You're not looking for the trainer of how to because that would serve the function. You're looking for someone to say, "Here's the areas that we're missing out on. Let's plug in and play so we can coach us up."

Speaker 1 (12:27):
Really good. So let's speak now to the early stage team leader who's got, let's just say, four or five agents around them, maybe one full-time someone doing some of the things you were doing when you were the assistant to the broker. I mean, you checked off I think four or five different things that you were doing. So let's go to that stage where the team leader who's watching or listening right now is really, they're doing the coaching, they're doing the training, they're also doing the recruiting on the front end of that. They're also needing to hold people accountable. Any tips for someone who has to try to do it all or is your gut answer the same as last time, which is like, break it apart, break down these functions and just make sure that you're doing these things on a consistent basis.

Speaker 3 (13:11):
So my answer for the team leader who's trying to do all is that you either find yourself in one or two umbrellas, which is the, I no longer have time to meet with my agents umbrellas because I have so many things to do and that means it's time to expand out. That means that it's time for someone else to come in or you're under the umbrella of, "I have so many things to do, but I'm not seeing my team at production and so I really should be the one." You're right, you should be. At that point, if your team is not functioning at maximum capacity, whatever you're doing is not a good use of your time the way it would be if you were pouring into those agents on one-on-one accountability. In that position, you are the coach. In that position, it is up to you to make sure that everyone is functioning at maximum capacity so you can get to the place to say, "Now I'm so full that we need someone else." That also works for lead generation.

Speaker 3 (14:09):
If you are thinking of bringing in an ISA, it should never be because my agents don't make the calls that supports them not actually doing the work. It should be a reward. My agents are doing so well with so many contracts that now one thing I could take off of their plate is lead generation and tee them up with more opportunities and ISA is doing your long-term nurture. Now it makes sense and you can present that to the team as a reward. If we get to X, Y, Z place, I'm going to take that off of your plate. I'm going to put an ISA in your database and that's going to be one more thing that we support y'all with.

Speaker 1 (14:46):
Who should add an ISA? Who shouldn't? Are there characteristics of the team? Are there ways that we're working? Is there like a transaction count or a lead count or an agent count where it starts to make sense to have an ISA and then we'll kind of peel into like how you think about what an ISA should be doing versus an agent and/or what some of the exceptions are to the normal rules there. But when should I start thinking about an ISA or an ISA function? I've also heard people say I should get two at once just so that there's friendly competition.

Speaker 3 (15:19):
By the way, I love that idea. If you can afford two at once, absolutely go for it. Of course, there is a distinction between whether you hire a virtual ISA or whether you hire an in- person one, but I digress from that. Let me answer your question first. Specifically, I don't think there's an agent count, but I do think there's a database size count. If you're going to have somebody who's making hundreds of calls per day, I would say you need a minimum of 8,000 leads in your database. 8,000 is a really healthy number where we're not calling the exact same people every single day. We can start to put people in nurture piles of every 90 days, every 30 days and so forth. So I would say minimum database size, you want to be at least at 8,000. And then as far as number of transactions, I would say your goal is that every person in your office already is at a minimum of two per month.

Speaker 3 (16:08):
That puts every agent at 24 closings. Okay, great. Now all I can do is continue to support you. If you have a larger team, I would average that. So for example, if you have a large team where the total average per agent equals that everyone approximately would be at two, that also is a good indicator. And you might decide that it's time to tier off and say, "Well, this particular agent who's over two, all agents over two closings, they are going to receive leads from ISAs. If you want those as well, you need to be at a minimum of two per month." And you can decide those metrics on a quarterly basis. The other thing that I would recommend is also number of conversations. Nothing beats number of conversations. For a lot of agents, even the ones who do well, they're on the rollercoaster of, "I have a ton of closings and now I got to go back and find where my next paycheck's coming around.

Speaker 3 (16:56):
A ton of closings." So the number of conversations you can never get away from, your minimum number of conversations is 35 per week. That is your minimum. There are teams right now doing 20 conversations per agent per day. Your minimum is 35 conversations in a week per agent, and if they're not doing that, they may not be the right culture fit for your team.

Speaker 1 (17:19):
I'm going to go back to where you started, which is domestic versus international, like in- house with the team or international. Pros and cons, any thoughts or observations there?

Speaker 3 (17:29):
I will tell you that typically you can get the same results from both, no doubt. Same results as in same number of closings, same number of responses. The difference that I have seen is that typically, and I wish this weren't the case, but typically international ISAs, they are hungrier for it. And so I see a larger call volume compared to those who are in the States. I have seen though, myself as an example, you find your unicorn who's obsessed with it and it makes no difference that they're local, right? Either way, I encourage there to be some sort of incentives for whether it's domestic or whether it's international.

Speaker 1 (18:16):
When I think about what I've heard talking with team leaders and recorded in on recorded conversations who've struggled with an ISA function, they're like, "Well, all they want to do is just become agents and so they're just looking for their next opportunity to get out of this seat and get into something else." So it becomes a little bit of a revolving door, which does have some benefits if you have a system for that. But talk about movement between agent and ISA and what you've observed.

Speaker 3 (18:41):
So movement first from ISA to agent, that can be great. They just need a minimum number of time and a minimum number of metrics. So within one year, so long as you have closed a minimum of let's say 40 transactions during one year, that tells me you're probably going to be great as an agent and you're probably going to do better than some of the agents we already have because you've been through it so many times. I would say minimum of one year is typically your expectation. Now, you might though say, "We don't want anyone like that. " Well, great news. That exists. I never wanted to be an agent. I never wanted to go on the in- person showings. I didn't want all of those hours of nighttimes, hours of writing contracts, et cetera. And so that exists. That's an option. But nonetheless, it doesn't mean that ... What I see happen is that some people pass on what would have been a good ISA because they mention wanting to be an agent.

Speaker 3 (19:33):
And so I wouldn't want that for any teams who are listening. And if you are an agent, the agents I see who become successful at ISA, they do lead gen consistently already. And what typically happens is that they're building a family or if somebody loses a job and they need the stability of some sort of salary included, et cetera, that can be a good transition as well. But if you have an agent who's not doing lead generation, and we see that sometimes too, I've seen agents who are just looking for the comfort of a salary, but showed no inclination that they would be excellent at doing so. So that would not be the right sort of slide.

Speaker 1 (20:11):
Okay. Gosh, I feel like I can just pepper you with quick follow-up questions. This is so fun. Okay. So you mentioned the benefit of a salary. Talk a little bit about what you've seen in terms of ratios of fixed to variable comp in that role. Any best practices or guidance for someone who has not figured out how to comp that role?

Speaker 3 (20:32):
A good ISA, it should be like 20 or 30% is salary and the rest is all commissions. A decent balance would be a fifty fifty of, okay, well, 50% of it is salary, 50% of it is commissions. Fantastic. But what I've seen or what I encourage is that there is some sort of incentive per closing or else you're going to lose the hunger and progress. The one thing that agents and ISAs have in common is that they did not choose strictly a salary position where the amount of work they did was going to equal the same amount of money, which means that if you take away that opportunity for carrots, that's where you see a dwindle in achievements because if I get a salary forever and you just have a salary ISA, well, that can fail in addition to commission only ones because if they don't see the turnaround right away, which we know we're in average 90 day turnaround periods, that's going to be discouraging.

Speaker 3 (21:29):
So I would say you start with a salary that's maybe a little beefed up and then after let's say three months, we should have seen a certain number of closings by then. And then from there, you can decrease in salary and say, "Okay, now we go to X, Y, Z after 90 days." You might be gracious enough if it makes sense in your team and say, "Okay, well, after that 90 days, we will wait up to an additional two or three months until your commission outweighs it. And then at that time we'll adjust it, but that's at your discretion."

Speaker 1 (22:00):
Talk about handoffs and division of labor between ISA and agent. In the beginning, obviously there's going to be some adjustment for agents. Again, we don't want to be rewarding bad behavior by hiring an ISA exclusively, like creating this new position and function exclusively to cover the weaknesses or gaps in A, their behavior, and B, your willingness to hold them accountable to expectations. So let's just say that's kind of on track and we implement an ISA. Talk a little bit about the cultural shift there and how you start defining boundaries of like, our ISA or ISAs do this and agents still do that. Talk about the division of labor a little bit.

Speaker 3 (22:44):
So this is, and I'm just going to go with your utopia. Your utopia of ISA an agent handoff looks like this. Your ISA has been nurturing all buyers up to the point to where they're able or willing to make a move within 90 days and all sellers up to the point where they're able or willing to make a move within one year. Okay, perfect. Once they've gotten them there, it makes sense for them to get over to an agent. I understand a lot of teams want a cold, hard pressed appointment in sense of date and time and location. I do not believe that that is best practice. I've seen that fail more often or even gatekeep leads that had they had a chance to warm up to the agent, that instead they would've ended up with more closings. Talented agents are going to have no problem with a handoff.

Speaker 3 (23:27):
And so the handoff should look like a group text and the group text looks as though it's for the client, but it's really for the agent, which means if Ethan is the agent, the group text looks like, "Hey, Lisa. Hey, Lisa, I'm so happy to introduce you to the best agent I've ever had the pleasure of working with, Ethan. Before you know it, we'll find your three bedroom, two bath house out on the water so that you can be closer to your parents out here. You are in good hands. We've included a brief amount of criteria and motivation. So if Ethan is on the road driving, he can immediately be prepared and take that call right away." That is our goal. But in addition to that, the one extra layer that I see that most teams skip is that they only excite the client for the agent and they do not excite the agent for the client.

Speaker 3 (24:18):
I called every agent before I made the handoff and said, "Ethan, I have got one for you. Here's all of the information that you need. You have any questions? I knew this person was going to be the right fit for you and here's why." Or if it's difficult, I'm going to tell you how it's difficult and why I trust that you're the one. Well, now the agent is equally excited to hear from me and I become the accountability partner. If you have it like that, it's now a symbiotic relationship because if you don't get ahold of the lead for any reason, you go three days in a row, call, text, and email. That's nine touches that have failed. I'm going to take it over again. We're already in a group text. It's going to be all too easy for me to continue nurturing them. That's a really healthy situation.

Speaker 3 (25:01):
In addition, best practice would be for you to keep communication inside of that group text. So if anything goes south or you're with a different lead at the time, the ISA is at least your backup, but you want your ISA to serve as maybe tentative follow-ups in case of emergency, not in place of agent.

Speaker 1 (25:21):
Agent excitement. I love that aspect of what you just shared there. And I assume some amount of that is in kind of the matchmaking, right? So let's just say an opportunity comes in however it comes in. It could be a sign call, it could be a portal lead, it could be anything. And the ISA is now talking with this person. They make some contact. They do whatever kind of, and we'll get into this too, like discovery, qualification, et cetera. Best practice in terms of what I would just generally call matchmaking. Is it on a rotation? Is it like, how should a team leader be thinking about I have a ... Whether or not it's a set appointment, let's just step back from that just the same as you did just to kick that last response off. But let's say it's a really good conversation that is agent ready.

Speaker 1 (26:08):
How do we get that to the right agent?

Speaker 3 (26:10):
So from that point, I've made the client aware that an agent and them will be in a group text and if we see anything worthwhile, you'll be the first person to have eyes on it. Okay, great. That part is done. And I personally am a fan of the tier system, which means that, for example, I don't want to assume that I know best who your fit is going to be, but I can, based on patterns, historically, tell you from your price point what agent is most likely to close you. If somebody has done two closings, I don't want to give them the million dollar deal. I want to give the person who has done 40 plus closings, the million dollar deal. And so you can, again, tier off and determine on that sort of rotation, all right, within this bracket, when the lead comes in, it goes to agent one and the next lead at that price point goes to agent two.

Speaker 3 (27:03):
"Ah, this one got a higher price point. It goes up. It goes to the next tier. Okay, perfect." And you can do a round robin in that sort of way to ensure that still you're honoring price point according to agent productivity.

Speaker 1 (27:16):
New opportunity comes into the CRM. The ISA is now going to try to call, email and text. Let's focus on the phone and let's focus on conversations and let's say someone actually picks up. Share some best practices there like from your hours in the seat and from the folks that you're getting feedback from through coaching and training. Give us some guidance there.

Speaker 3 (27:40):
So best practice, number one, I am treating every lead. This is going to cause conflict. I'm treating every lead as-

Speaker 1 (27:49):
Honestly, we don't really do that on the show, so it's kind of a fun setup to a response.

Speaker 3 (27:55):
I treat every lead as though they're a buyer, because 90% of sellers are also a buyer. They're also focused on where they're going, which means my introduction starts as though I'm sending you properties. I'm double checking to see if you're still looking. Okay, great. Worst case scenario, they say no, and I say, "Oh, does that mean you're moving out of town?" Even though I can see clearly that they came for a home valuation, now they've volunteered that they would be selling, which tends to make them a little calmer rather than me saying, "Are you selling?" No, I was just looking. So I prefer that method. My goal with buyers, and I'll just stick with buyers from here on out for this part, but I want to get them into the question as fast as possible. Are you looking for an investment property or a place for yourself?

Speaker 3 (28:36):
And that means even if you're waiting, perfect. When the time comes along, are you looking for an investment property or a place for yourself? Because now I can get them into criteria. Criteria is non-threatening questions. These are questions that people have already entered, which means they are low pressure left brain checkbox questions. Great. Now I have earned enough time with you to ask higher quality questions, which is motivation next. Motivation questions I need to live in for a minimum of two minutes. Every single website can collect their timeline and criteria. The only thing that separates this human to human connection is whether I can discuss your why. There's no section for that online. After I've uncovered motivation, and that's what's going to make every follow-up stronger, not for me to say, "Were you looking for a three-two still?" But to say, "I know you wanted to be closer to your grandkids out here.

Speaker 3 (29:27):
Is that still the game plan?" Now I go to timeline. The mistake is that agents go for the things they're hungriest for, which is finance and timeline first. Are you pre-approved? When are you wanting to move? And they put their agenda upfront, which is never the leads agenda. The lead is focused on what they want and why they want it. So we're going to put our disruptive emotions and our desires and needs last. Timeline will always be last. Even if you told me at the beginning you were waiting three years, great. We're not going to discuss it until the end. And then very last, typically after I've set an appointment Shitment, I'll discuss financing and say, "By the way, were you doing cash or financing or a bit of both?" But that structure, if more people would marry the structure, their conversations would feel different.

Speaker 1 (30:13):
Okay. Let's go into motivation a little bit. I have a feeling that there are some people who just kind of ask a generic kind of like, "So what's got you looking?" Kind of thing. Give us some script tip stuff on really getting into motivation and not necessarily taking the first kind of shallow answer that someone provides to really get at what is motivating this person so that you can engage them more effectively going forward and really serve them best.

Speaker 3 (30:43):
Yeah. And 100% serve them best. That's the truth. And so your strategy there is question one. I haven't asked you the most important question yet, which is gently tapping on the curiosity side. Of all the reasons, now we've fully woken up the right side of the brain to say this is creative response. Of all the reasons for you to make a move, what is it that has you looking in the first place? That's really different than what's got you looking. That can stay left brain and get you more criteria answers. So that's our first question. To make sure you get past the surface, you take any word that they have said or series of words and you create the next question. Ethan says he's looking for a change. What type of change are you looking for? I'm looking for a change of pace. What does the pace feel like where you're living right now?

Speaker 3 (31:31):
It's kind of slower. Okay. Well, since it's slower, when you make this move to this different lifestyle where it's faster a pace, what does life look like then? But by using one word, that helps you to get past the shallow. Too many people accept awesome, they're looking for a change. That doesn't tell me what I need to know yet.

Speaker 1 (31:49):
Yeah. And it also, I mean, just to stay with what you haven't learned until you ask the follow-up question, what is slow to this person? When you ask what a faster lifestyle looks like, you're going to get a much better sense of what slow and what today looks like. Yep.

Speaker 3 (32:03):
I love that. Exactly.

Speaker 1 (32:05):
And do you have any exceptions at all around where and how to start these conversations based on lead type or lead source or origin?

Speaker 3 (32:17):
The only exception I make in a conversation regarding the structure would be if they start in motivation, I'll live in motivation because you brought it up. I'm not going to skip it and say, "Well, I have to do criteria." As far as lead source distinctions, the only distinction for me is if they are a FISBO, then I will start that conversation different because my goal is to be the first agent or ISA that you are talking with and ultimately getting your door knock from. If I'm the first one, most FSBOs are going to sell within, or they're going to be listed with an agent within six weeks. So you're likely to work with the person who you met. It's my responsibility to get that person who has met over to you, right? The other exception would be for anybody who has withdrawn or expired. That's the only other introduction shift that I have.

Speaker 1 (33:04):
Let's talk about scripts. Philosophy on scripts. I think a lot of people are training scripts, just to go back to your differentiation between coaching and training. I think there are a lot of people who are training scripts. I think your philosophy is similar to mine in that it points you in the right direction. It gives us a healthy framework. We do want to be doing things like using their words back to them in a variety of ways, as you just gave a really good example of. Any other thoughts for people who are really script fixated or aren't sure on the right balance of how hard should I be about scripts and/or when I'm watching or listening to calls back, how hard am I going to be on someone for like not following the script? Just script philosophy high level.

Speaker 3 (33:54):
Your script is a safety net. It is not a box. If you feel boxed in on your script, you're doing it wrong. It should feel like no matter where they go in a conversation, I know where I'm headed. That's a good safety net. That's a good script. It should feel like Michelle Duncan and I were talking about this when you're driving and you start to go off the road and it goes. That's what the script feels like. We just spent a little too much time. You brought up that you're moving with dogs. Oh, beautiful. What's your dog's name? That's natural. I shouldn't say how many bedrooms and bathrooms are you looking for? That's weird. I'm listening to you, but if we spend too much time on those dogs, that's my ... So now I have to bring it back into criteria. Well, since you mentioned you got those two great danes, should I be thinking about a backyard for those dogs as I'm looking?

Speaker 3 (34:44):
That's how we move back in. So your script should really feel like it's giving us the chance to uncover, but we're not losing our humanity by using it.

Speaker 1 (34:56):
Talk to me a little bit about conditions versus objections. As we're getting into a conversation, I really love the distinction between these two. Feel free to follow your own interest in making sure that team leaders and agents who are watching and listening are starting to practice the same way that you advise the thousands of folks that you worked with.

Speaker 3 (35:16):
So this is the part where I would be more hard on an agent. On a script, if I'm listening back and you miss a little bit, that's okay. Did you get their main things? Cool. You can have a follow-up call as long as you get the main things. But when it comes to objections, the mistake for an objection is that somebody runs to tackle it. They say, "Oh, I heard this at the sales meeting and they just information dump onto the person." That doesn't work. And so the area I'm most strict in is making sure, did you ask a minimum of three questions before you went for any solutions? Now, the distinguishing factor between an objection and condition, condition means that I can't change it. You're going through a divorce. I have no say in that. You've lost a loved one. You're currently taking care of somebody with health issues.

Speaker 3 (36:08):
That's not an objection. That's a condition. That's outside of my realm to be able to alter. But something like an objection, we can change. You're worried about interest rates. There's so many solutions. There's possibly new constructions. We could buy it down. If we don't buy it down, we could possibly get the seller to buy it down. You name it. You might be able to have a large enough down payment for us to be able to. But I can't tell you that yet until you are prepared for the answer. You have leads who've been holding onto an interest rate fear since COVID. My 30 second, 60 second pitch does not change years of an objection. So I need to ask more questions before I ever get into the solution. Here is the second mistake though. Someone hears interest rates and they tackle with questions and now a new something pops up.

Speaker 3 (37:04):
And now a new something pops up. And now all of a sudden we feel like a used car salesman, who everything that they say, we just go and we knock it down. That's easy to correct. When someone says they're worried about something, the first time I don't pay in any mind, I say, "Okay, I hear you. But I don't worry about it because I may have just said real estate and so you think interest rates. I'm going to wait till you say it a second time to make sure it's true because if it's real, it'll come up again." And then I say, "Is there anything else besides interest rates that has you waiting as of now?" And I'm going to keep asking until we run out of reasons. Once I've uncovered all the reasons, I'm going to priororitize them. Priorities of objections, decision makers are first, personal finances are next, and then finally umbrella terms like market, like economy, politics, those are least important.

Speaker 3 (37:57):
Now I go into my questions minimum of three per objection. So before I go pushing all of my answers on interest rates, I'm going to find out where you're at first. Appropriate interest rate questions, because I know this is coming up for so many right now, is first to ask and say, "Okay, I'm curious, what sort of interest rate would you be comfortable with and what sort of monthly payment are you looking for? " And tell me, do you know of any ways for you to get a lower interest rate? That allows them the chance for self-importance. If they do have something, I'm going to praise them for being the type who does research. And if they don't, that gives them now the more prepared mindset to say, "No, what is it? " Now I can give you answers.

Speaker 1 (38:43):
Okay. So we're not dealing with objections one-off. We are collecting them all and letting them exhaust any of those. We are parsing conditions from objections. If I'm you, I've never been in your seat. So if I'm you, I'm probably, I'm actually holding a pencil right now. I'm probably writing these things down.

Speaker 3 (39:04):
I am.

Speaker 1 (39:04):
Yeah. So you're on the phone. Let's just go back to killing it as an ISA version of Nikki. You're writing this down on paper or you're typing notes as you go. How are you tracking all this stuff so that you can keep it organized?

Speaker 3 (39:19):
So I started first by writing it down because I was afraid somebody would hear the keyboard sound and eventually I realized I wasn't writing fast enough. I type way faster. And the one or two times somebody mentioned, "Are you typing?" I say, "Yes, ma'am, this is so important that I get this right." And so I just want to make sure that my notes are all prepared as we're talking and I continue typing. But the typing thing, it allowed me to collect because sometimes people talk so fast that I miss. Oh, they mentioned they'd need to sell a property, but since I didn't write it down, I just went full on buyer mode and I never addressed. Was that property local? Were they planning on selling it before they moved or they can buy first and then sell? So I'm writing all the things down and I'll even like highlight the thing that's important to make sure.

Speaker 3 (40:06):
Or I'll put little asterisk marks, that way I make sure to go back and don't miss

Speaker 1 (40:10):
Anything. Okay. I know that there is someone who used to take notes either by hand or by typing and they're like, "Well, I got an AI summary now." Thoughts or opinions on that?

Speaker 3 (40:22):
Sorry, I didn't mean to laugh. Your AI summary is useful as a summary. That is it. But what makes someone feel connected to you, because remember, nobody is working with the smartest. They're working with who they like. The AI summary isn't going to tell you that they were picking up their kids while you were talking. And if you wrote down that they were picking up their kids, now your next follow up can be, "I bet you're probably in the carpool line. This will make me think of your great Dane Jake. Look at this Instagram video." That's a personal touch. So you're likely missing out because you're automatically summarizing key details rather than those personal details if you would've just written it out instead.

Speaker 1 (40:59):
As I've been listening to some of your language and some of your approach and some of your structure, I feel like it works in any condition because it's really just about discovering what's driving this person and what's top of mind for them and what are some of their kind of emotional attachments, particular words or ideas that also kind of add color to the motivation and the types of ways we can engage with these people. It feels pretty timeless, but like in terms of scripting or structuring, has anything really changed in your time of executing it and/or teaching other people?

Speaker 3 (41:32):
I will say in my time, the only difference I've seen is a larger amount of sales skepticism. That's the biggest difference. The more time that goes by, the more important it is that I am basically like immediately adjusting from the point that I hear someone. I used to say, you have the first 15 seconds to figure out how someone is. I don't. I now have the way that they say hello for me to figure out whether I need to be chipper or I need to be calm or how I need to adjust. The way that they speak from that first moment, I need to line up with faster because sales skepticism is so much higher. They're getting more crank calls. They're getting more text messages from someone they didn't realize they signed up with and so forth. And so for that reason, you have to get it right the first time.

Speaker 3 (42:21):
And that's where I get the most frustrated. We have every opportunity to master our sales skills because we don't have leads that are meeting together to make it harder on us and to say, "Let's practice our objections so we can make it tougher." They're going to keep saying the same thing. So we have the opportunity to master what we're going to say and how we move in a conversation, but so many of us overlook it and instead we get sold. We hear them and we say, "Oh yeah, I'm sold on the fact that they weren't serious." Nevermind the fact we could have sold them on how it's possible. And so if one of us is going to end up with the ability for opportunity, I'm going to discover and see what the opportunity is. I'm not tied to you moving here. I'm just tied if you are making that move that you choose to work with us.

Speaker 1 (43:08):
What you make me think about here is AI. When I think about like the flexibility and the reaction and the idea that there is this sales skepticism that you do have to read the situation and mirror back a little bit and or adjust or bring it around or be more chipper or these types of things. I'm sure one day AI will get there, but in the meantime, this ability to like master the skill of connecting with another person and breaking through whatever kind of little barrier they want to put up straight away is a distinctly human opportunity. Am I underselling AI in this situation?

Speaker 3 (43:46):
No, I think you're exactly right. The only purpose I can see for AI is your database of 100,000 people and of course your 30 agents, your 100 agents are not going to get to all 100,000. So at that point, your AI can help you because you have such a imbalance of number of leads. So then in that way, okay, great. It's not as though you're going to injure opportunity, you're going to miss out on opportunity otherwise. So in that way, absolutely, your AI makes sense. And you can basically figure that out according to agent and database ratio. You might have two agents and have 20,000 leads. Okay. Again, we're in the same situation all over again, but it's not as though AI is completely ineffective. I suspect with more time, we'll get used to AI callers if they're smart like that and then it will be more comfortable, but we're not there yet.

Speaker 3 (44:40):
And as far as agents are concerned, we definitely are hanging on by that human by human connection.

Speaker 1 (44:45):
Yeah. So this is a skill we need today. It's one we can continue working on. I appreciate you sharing all this. This was super fun. I really enjoyed it. As you may know, I have three pairs of closing questions. You can answer one or the other or both. The first one is what is your very favorite team to root for or what's the best team you've ever been a member of?

Speaker 3 (45:04):
My favorite team to root for, don't kill me guys. It's the Yankees. My dad was a Yankee fan and for that reason, it just has a soft spot for me when they play. I'm overly attached. Nevermind that I'm from Texas. I love rooting. When the Yankees are on, and I feel genuinely emotionally bought in and territorial as though it's my team. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (45:29):
I think it's wonderful the way that does get passed down. I mean, in some cases it's unfortunate just because I don't like a particular team that way, but in general, just such a wonderful thing for that to be passed down and inherited just as like an emotional attachment. What is one of your most frivolous purchases or what is a cheapskate habit you hold onto, Nikki, even though you don't need to anymore?

Speaker 3 (45:51):
The cheap skate habit that I hold onto is everything in the bathroom must finish before it's thrown away.

Speaker 2 (46:00):
Which

Speaker 3 (46:00):
Means every shampoo bottle, conditional bottle. I don't like the soap. I'm still finishing the soap. It doesn't matter what the thing is in the bathroom, it 100% has to be at completion before it can be thrown out. Which to be honest, guys, I have a soap right now that I was thinking about that. I was like, "I don't even like this soap, but I'm not getting rid of it until it's done."

Speaker 1 (46:19):
That's so funny. I feel like just because of some of my own thoughts about my own behavior that that triggered, this has definitely come up before because I'm thinking about cutting the ends off of some of those things that are like in that inverted flat top but kind of opens up to a triangle in a pinched ending. You cut those off, you could squeeze it out that way because it's always hard to get it out the proper way out. I just got done and now I'm thinking of like an oversized, like a moisturizer type thing with the pump on top and just like working that thing to get it out. Yeah, I'm with you. I'm using it all.

Speaker 3 (46:58):
Yeah. And I also realized I used to move so often. I have cardboard boxes. I never get rid of boxes after the move. They all get folded up and put in the garage and I don't care how much time goes by. In my mind, it's like, why would I spend on boxes again when those boxes are perfectly good? I have boxes that are like 10 years old. I just realized that because they've been crossed out from Sharpie so many times that it's just like guest office, no bedroom, master bathroom. So yeah.

Speaker 1 (47:28):
Nikki, we have been in our house for almost 20 years now and I have boxes piled up and put into heavy duty plastic garbage bags downstairs in my crawl space for whatever day. It hasn't come in 20 years, but whatever you have to need them. Yeah. Okay. I feel like I should start a cheapskate show. It'd be really fun because I can match and identify with any guest. What does it look like for you, Nikki? What are you doing when you're investing time in resting, relaxing, and recharging? Or what are you doing? What does it look like when you're investing time and learning, growing, and developing?

Speaker 3 (48:08):
I'm more so priorititize learning and developing time. I'm a big fan of audio books and as far as audio books are concerned, if I'm cooking or I'm doing laundry or I'm doing something else, I'm listening to a book. My husband and I are listening to a book in the car right now every time we're in the car. But for me, I've heard some people say you'd be better off reading the same book multiple times a year in terms of retention. And I believe that there's some validity to that, but for me, this goes to what could I use today? And that one extra thing could be the thing today that helps for the push. So I don't mind if I go through 50 books in a year because each of the days that I was listening, something else became better for.

Speaker 1 (48:55):
I like the idea of ingesting things, whether it's an audiobook or a podcast or something else as kind of raw material and then using some time where I'm not consuming anything at all. And this one idea from over here will match up with this long held idea or this long held practice and kind of influence it in a new and different way. So it's not even necessarily the tactic itself. It's just the tactic sitting in my conscious or subconscious, waiting to be activated by the intersection with another idea that makes it useful to me.

Speaker 3 (49:27):
For the record though, Ethan, that's such a compliment to you because they say that that's the layer of genius is the ability to hear something and apply it in a different area or a different field, which is where many of us are hindered because we hear that thing and we isolate it. Even some of the agents I work with, they're excellent at deep question asking, but in their personal lives, they don't do the same. And so it's one of those, can it apply to all areas things? I love that entirely.

Speaker 1 (49:53):
Awesome. Thank you. I feel really good about myself. That was very generous of you. Okay. If someone has gotten to this point, they obviously enjoyed the conversation. They maybe want to follow up. They don't want to maybe miss your next webinar or something else like that. Where would you send people to follow up on this conversation?

Speaker 3 (50:09):
Definitely add me on Facebook, Nikki Pice. I'm posting free content all the time in there. I work with Digital Maverick and Easy HomeSearch. If you want free content as well, every other Wednesday with Easy HomeSearch, we do shut up and dial where we do an hour of live calls. So if you want to, you can listen and see for yourself as well. Are those techniques really working? And you'll see over and over again that they are. So it's www.ezydials.com. Cool.

Speaker 1 (50:40):
That stuff is linked up down below. Nikki, I appreciate you. I hope you have a great start to your year. Thank you for doing this first week of January. This is going to release, I think, the first week of February. It's just a great way to kick off the year on the show. Appreciate you so much. So glad to be connected.

Speaker 3 (50:54):
Thank you for having me, Ethan.

Speaker 2 (50:56):
Thanks for checking out this episode of Team OS. Get quick insights all the time by checking out Real Estate Team OS on Instagram and on TikTok.